... recently, I have noticed to my dismay that the site has been bombarded with so-called themes that are little more than wallpapers with pictures of scantily clad models.

I don't mind the erotic nature of the images - I like a pretty girl as much as the next fella - but the people who are battering M9 with this rubbish have made no attempt to create any kind of proper theme. All they do is throw an image or two into TC and then submit it as a theme. In my view, it's just another sort of

Is there no quality control on M9?

To be honest, I'm beginning to feel ashamed of M9 and I certainly wouldn't recommend anyone who wants a quality theme to visit at the moment. That makes me very sad as I am a very keen M9er.

We once did reject files for being poor quality, however we haulted this as it discouraged new talent on Mobile9- everyone has to start somewhere and rejecting files is a very good way of putting people off .

Some things we introduced to try and combat this issue:

• Gallery Hall of Fame: http://gallery.mobile9.com/hof/. If you sort by the competitions you will find files from people who want to improve if not very good already. You can then click on the uploaders' profiles to view more themes by these user which will be of the same standard.
• We also have the featured content option. If you check the show featured only box (it is located in the gallery search at the top of the page) and click "Go" it will only show you files of the highest quality on Mobile9- editors picks.

Some more ideas that may help this issue:

• Have a gallery which has files for recognized uploaders on mobile9 e.g. search themes by certified themers. Could put this in HoF or as an advanced search option like featured.
• Have another gallery rating system which can only be used by recognised mobile9 members where they can rate a file.
• Have an option in a users profile so it only shows featured content in the galleries

Unfortunately, all these except the featured file option puts a bias on uploaders who are active in the forum

I think there is an obvious difference between new themers who make some effort to produce a viable theme and the spammers who upload complete rubbish. Many of these 'themes' consist of one image and no attempt has been made to make menu bars, tabs, etc. They don't even edit the text colours! I've seen themes published on M9 with white text on a white background. What use is that to anyone?

I'm sorry to say this but I think your reasons for halting the upload filter is a cop-out.

This rubbish is damaging M9's reputation.

thats y we have the featured files to diferentiate between the run of mill stuff and the extra-ordinary stuff

so sorry iam

as i can see you want to show your friends the best ,true quality themes
So i guess you tell them to search in the most downloaded theme of the week ,month or of all time
so you won't need to worry about their quality cause they all are great!

these themes would by naturally be made by some great themer's in m9

That's all well and good but very few proper themes make it into the Featured Files category. My themes are never going to set the world on fire but they are functional and are properly constructed.

I create all my own bars, tabs, pop-ups, etc. and I take great care to ensure that my themes are as functional as possible. Despite that, I have only got two featured themes under my belt.

The M9 site contains many excellent themes and it benefits from the talents of some truly gifted themers. However, their work is buried under a mountain of dross.

We all know why there is no quality control. It's labour intensive and admin just can't be bothered. So why not say so?

What would you think if you walked into a Ferrari or Porche showroom and found the place littered with milk floats and wheelbarrows?

"Oh, the nice cars are in the back room," says the salesman.

"I'm off to a Jaguar dealer," says I.

Thos seems to becoming more of you think your way is better, then the current way.
1 - Its not Admin cant be bothered but they cant reject every creation just becaus its not good, they do however feature only the great files, which trust me is very labour intensive!
2 - you said it your elf your themes wont set the world on fire, now look at this scenario, if admin rejects on basis of quality, you upload a thme you think is good, the admin looks at it and his / her opinion is that your file is crap so it gets rejected how would you feel, most people would just give up there and then, instead of trying again and make better stuff.

you cant compare M9 to a car delership, everything is free at m9, if i gave you a car for free, no matter the condition it might be a crappy VW beetle or a brand new ferari would you take it knowing you might end up with either and not spend a cent?

again if you only want the good stuff just clik on display featured only

hmmm....
should i post my views on this topic or will it be yet another post of mine that goes the way of the dodo?

I see what you mean about the admin nowdays. I had no idea things had degenerated so much.



I will be leaving and I be will be taking ALL of my themes with me unless someone gives me a sensible answer that makes some sense!

THE COUNTDOWN HAS STARTED.

Reading your now willing to leave is not good especially as you have been a member for little over 3 years, i personally cannot comment about you removing your themes . so ill offer you a reply as i have nowt to loose by a few truthful words, but judging by my previous posts being removed i wouldnt be surprised if this one is deleted also.


While im sure these type of themes generate good downloads for the site due to their nature, i agree these themes are very poor indeed & even though i appreciate a good woman myself, these themes are crap...pure & simple, with no imagination, creativity or effort going into them but instead simply relying on some half naked bodies to do the trick!... but... lately galleries are being swamped with what appears to be a M9's personal lingerie catalogue.

& i think this just attacks a sites reputation over time whereby seasoned members simply give up.


I believe there is control over the type of themes we view & certainly M9 has an excellent morral ethic when it comes to removing leeched material but i dont think we can control quality as this would simply mean... no newbies could share their early theme attempts & that would be totally wrong to implement...besides we all have to start at the beginning!

Should we just rely on the "featured" files inorder to seperate quality from poor... no!... as the featured section simply does not work & how many times do we read members complaining about this topic...ive lost count!

Now usually when a member complains about things like this, we see replies like... another member disagreeing for the hell of it & thinking this will earn some brownie points with admin... it shouldnt bcos those posts dont prove anything...or we are asked to offer alternative ideas along with our complaints... but as i found out recently...that dont work either!

so in fairness, we can complain all we like... but no one pays any attention to it thus why the problems just gets worse!

& this is why site forums are so dead comparred to the rest of the site.

( & yes another member has placed a bet with me, this post will be deleted )

edit:
hmm looks like i lost the bet

@Paul
First of all, I know you and you are a very keen M9er. No point denying that.

Vince & vegeta have provided you some explanations on why these days we only reject files which:
- consists of pornographic material
- has been stolen & reported
- has incomplete preview
- consists of copyrighted material

I know there is one similar web site which uses public vs private files when validating their gallery. Whatever the admins think NOT suitable to be in public gallery, files will be made private (available only in the uploader's profile gallery). The end result? Lots of complaints everyday from users who want to know why on earth is their perfectly ok files in their own eyes end up being made private.

These days, majority of sites which consists of user-generated items do things differently. All items published is made public, admins do not decide which items are good to be seen by million of people. Admins only remove certain files that violate their terms of service. I'm talking about sites like YouTube (+ a zillion of other video hosting sites) , Deviantart, Digg and many more. What these sites have common is the way they make good content to be found.

YouTube - great search engine (needless to say, who owns the site? The search engine giant, Google)
Deviantart - good filter (you can choose to view popular items in hrs, days, month, all time) + featured items (using Daily Deviation)

Everyone thinks their uploads are good & therefore worth being made available to the general public. And truth is there are people who want & download these so call "wallpaper themes". What we can do is create better filters to highlight what the people and us think is good themes (download count, ratings, favourites, winning entries in competitions). I sometimes feature themes that don't meet the criteria to be featured yet. Why? Because they are of great quality but sometimes get buried too fast. And we have a 88-pages thread - I think this file should be featured. Does these warrant a so call "admin just can't be bothered" claim? I will leave it to the other M9ers to make their own judgement.

Edit:
P/S: I saw Nemesis's reply only after I posted this reply.

Ah... some reasoned debate at last. What a relief.

I've calmed down now.

Whether or not my files are featured has never bothered me much so I've never got involved in that debate. And brownie points are just brownie points. If it was money, I might care more!

To be honest, what really bugs me is the the gallery front page that is presented to visitors.

It is full of rubbish themes, none of which have a preview.

If M9 INSISTED on a preview image, then the blurts who submit the rubbish themes would fade away. Most of them either wouldn't bother or wouldn't know how to create such an image. Proper themers, even newbies, wouldn't have a problem with that. I think it could be a very effective filter.

____________________________________

ABOUT these Galleries...

A crap stuff is to input the Sony Ercsson part to share the same dish with the Symbian and Nokia part.

They are nothing in common, and cannot compare the huge Nokia users population with the SE in counterpart...

____________________________________

Also would point to pdownes when writing about the trash themes uploading - that is the thing what happens when you open the
upload posibility to all and everybody....

There is some children uploading themes... and then they are calling in - that they share... "Lalalalalala... I have MYYYYY themes uploadeeeeed, at M9"

When I had propsed the filter with Themers Personnal Threads showing up some themes first, before Uploading, i become a bad guy...

So now you have what you have - so be happy : 900.000 trash and crap of the 1.000.000

It is in fact yet a good result - if it is true...

A good idea to have more featured files on the first page as aposed to 1 or 2 we have on the top.

in old m9 we used to have a frontpage that would show the best files per galery etc.


@ pdownes2001 i dont understand what you mean by insist on preview, a theme gets rejected if no previwes are uploaded with the file

Thats cool, i wasnt expecting my post to remain anyway, so it looks like i lost that bet


All uploads display a screenshot so im guessing what you meant was.. the additional previews that members can upload whereby we see a fuller preview of the themes ( like displayed in personal threads & competitons )
I used to upload these full previews till i realised most people make their decission to download the theme based on what they see on the gallery single screenshot itself...but...
To display full screenshots in a personal thread... the reward is the feedback from other members!
To display full screenshots in a competition thread... the reward is feedback & potential podium! ( if your lucky )
To display full screenshots in the galleries as part of the uploads process... no reward, no incentive, no appreciation!

& yet if admin introduced & allocated awards for this extra effort made by members for their theme screenshot presentations, then this would then be seen as an incentive & encouragement....& maybe more members will make more of an effort to upload better screenshots to the galleries than what we are currently seeing.... better screenhots, better presentation...overall better for the site!


Each gallery page displays screenshots of 15 themes ( not including the featured theme at the top )
but if a member uploads 10 babe themes then yes this is what visitors will be greeted with...10 babes in a row! but.... there is nothing stopping team members from breaking these 10 babes up... 5 could be allocated to the next page & 5 other themes from page 2 brought forward thus visitors view a wider variety on display.
Personally however i think the screenshots are set too small so we loose the potential quality of the screenshot anyway!!!


Then it would seem Zjurina, you & i have something in common but if its a public forum then why be afraid to post what you feel as long as its within site rules. I would rather read honest challenging discussions designed to make admin aware of what is affecting its members & push a site forward in the right direction than reading the usual "hello mr admin, i love you, now gimme some icon packs" ..... rubbish!
Those posts simply push people away from entering a forum after their initial visit as they offer no reason to return...which of course totally contradicts all these rewards catered for forum users only.

@ vegeta sa

By a 'preview' I mean a full preview of the complete theme like this one which I made for my Jaguar theme.

http://john.mobile9.com/download/wmpreview...240176619-2.png

It appears on the theme's page under the More Preview heading.

They are simple to construct. They are only screenshots of Theme Creator's Preview All page, which have been pasted into a graphics package. It can even be done in Paint. No special skills are required that would be beyond anyone capable of creating a proper theme.

If an uploader cannot create such a preview, then they are unlikely to know how to create a complete theme. That is the simple filter that I propose.

AHHH
Basicaly a full screen shot of all the theme pages, thats a good idea

This is an option already availabe to those who want to add additional screenshots when uploadng anyway...but i cant see admin "insisting" this has to be done bcos even though i agree with you they are easy to construct...they can be time consuming.... & i cannot see newbies learning how to improve theme creating can then be expected to make a full preview like the one you have as your example.

The only way would be for admin to promote & encourage members to upload additional screenshots & then implement a badge or notification visible to the viewer on the gallery pages that the uploader has added additional screenshots, like they offer notifications for "new" & "featured"

Maybe then, if members who go the extra mile with their theme presentation could be credited in someway, then "maybe" this will encourage more members to try as well.

But in fairness.... most people decide to download a theme based on first impressions when viewing the main screenshot in the galleries anyway

Well, it seems most of us agree that something needs to be done.

Whatever the solution is, I am sure that it has got to be better than the current setup.

Whether it's granting Featured status to more themes (note, my animated Jaguar theme as shown earlier has not been featured, although I'm not bothered by that) or using a Full Preview as a filter or some other solution, I don't really care much - as long as it is effective.

Clearly, the current situation is in urgent need of improvement as I believe that most new visitors will download a theme from the first gallery they see on the front page and it's very likely that the theme will be an incomplete, disfunctional load of rubbish.

For example,

Can you read the menu text? Can you see the time? More importantly, if you put this on your phone, would you keep it?

First impressions are important.

most of us?
well if you mean the 8 people who posted so far which includes 2 admin & even then, not everyone has agreed ( even though the view count exceeds 240 at the time of posting this )

Now if we were giving away prizes, im sure the post count would have tripled by now!

Ref: the example screenshot you posted...
All these tutorials, all these competitions, & all these so called mentors of theming... will not change the drop in quality of themes on this or any other site bcos people have simply got into a habit of uploading trash bcos they have been allowed too!

But even trash themes generates money for someone bcos if they didnt, you would then see a stricter control over quality

I think you've hit the nail on the head there. Spot on. When someone prefers to make an easy buck, it can be difficult to make them see the error of their ways. It is a short-sighted policy that usually comes to grief eventually.

The mentality of quantity over quality is alien to me. I work as an engineering craftsman at a Jaguar car factory where quantity is certainly important but quality is the top priority. What is quality? My definition of quality is simple. Quality = what pleases the customer.

If someone downloads a theme and is happy with it, then the quality is good and they will come back for more. They will even spread the word. Without quality, any business is doomed to eventual failure.

There is always a fine balance between mass adoption & going niche. Ferrari chose to go niche, they produce only cars a handful of million/billionaires can buy. Ford on the other hand, chose to go mass. They produce cars that most people can afford and therefore help to make automobile a commodity. They exist for different reason and serve different type of people. I love my Mac but I'm forever grateful to Microsoft & Bill Gates for bringing computers to every household.

In V5 (launched Jan 2009), we should add more advertisement slots because our revenue drops in accordance to the global financial crisis. But we did exactly the opposite. If you have been paying attention, we removed a couple of advertisement slots. What is it for? For better user experience. I can't resist telling you this because I personally feel we have done a lot in this aspect and don't deserve the accusation of choosing easy bucks over our people, our customers.

Btw, we have emailed three members who constantly upload the type of themes mentioned above and ask that they do not upload them in the future.

So, the usual suspect is indeed everywhere.


As usual, yet another blatant accusation. Is money the only concern for quality control? Does mobile9 generate X2 more income from half naked girls than 'super cool themes'?

@pdownes2001: Your concern is valid. We're aware of this problem, and working on a decent solution. When it's released, hopefully we are able to see people helping to clean the gallery.

And to the 'usual suspect', please refrain from posting the same issue in 10000 other threads, especially when it's in the same subforum. We know you have nothing else to do apart from picking on every single thing that we do but... you need to realize coming from you means it's unlikely to carry any weight.

Yet another blatant accusation?
wheres the accusation in my post?
come to think of it...wheres the 1000 other threads?

& the only reason why my posts dont carry any weight, is bcos your too busy deleting them for the wrong reasons

Excellent but ...
because there is still no control filter, some of the themes are worse than bad. They are pornographic.

Ok, I know they are quickly removed after they have been reported but they can still be seen in the gallery and it takes time for them to be removed.

So far, the worst one I've seen is a close up of a girl performing oral sex on a bloke. That's bad enough but it could get worse.

Ask yourself what would happen to YOU as an M9 administrator if someone uploaded child porn?

There would be a big KNOCK on your door, methinks, from PC Plod and his mates. And rightly so. To coin a phrase, "Your ar*e is out the window."

YOU NEED CONTROL FOR YOUR OWN PROTECTION.

You only have to read the reply i received from the site owner to know you are banging your head against a brick wall trying to raise or highlight issues...
For your troubles you are met with unjust counter accusations to shift the spotlight back onto you or the attempts to insult you inorder to provoke a reply just so you can offer them a perfect excuse to ban you... while the people who upload this filth get away with it scot free ( now tell me theres no money to gain hosting such filth )

Yep thats community spirit in a nut shell

Did you just missed that?

Nemesis, if you're so unhappy here and we are as bad as you say we are, we can close your account and you may move on to wherever you feel happier

Whether I'm banging my head against a brick wall or not - it's my choice.

With logic, reason, sensible arguments, respect for and a willingness to accept others' viewpoints without resorting to vitriol, I usually get what I want.

You can have a jolly good row or you can have a jolly good result. Rarely can you have both.

I do not see what purpose will be served by me offering a reply, considering you have already made your statement my posts carry no weight in your forum.
also offering a reply which then makes me out to be the guilty person for taking this topic off track even though it was you who threw your insults towards me!

but bcos i read this...

I will offer you a reply which will be my last on this site ( smiles all round im sure )

I missed nothing, i read everything... i also posted in this topic bcos i agreed with the topic creator & if theres one thing i know about forums, is that if a member posts something of value, then others should show their appreciation & offer a reply of some sort...so this is what i did, as i feel its far more important than to read the crap most others post in their futile attempts to suck up to admin as this offers no incentive for newbies to return to your forum after their initial visit.

I then made an additional topic of my own shortley after, where i had made the effort to provide screenshots demonstrating my "requests for admin to consider"... of which at the time i actually thought the site may benefit from, considering ive been a gallery moderator for longer than i was a themer...& for what?...To be subjected to an insult... even after you had privatley explained to me about ways to take this site forward in a new direction ( your words )

My posts may come across negative but did it ever once cross your mind that its the reader who chooses to view them negatively rather than me actually writting them so?

I never once made any accusation in my posts about mobile9 guilty of trying to make a quick buck from the filth being uploaded onto this site, what i said was...

I also said...
...this also applies to the files that breach sites rules.... how does this comment carry no weight, when im actually offering praise to your site?
of which i stand by what i have said bcos in my opinion mobile9 does indeed protect its members contributions & by far, more than any other site i know, but there is always room for improvement & this was all i was ever trying to point out!

As for your comment regarding my accounts closure....
You do what you feel is right, if my account remains, i will continue to contribute my new themes!

We do have control. We validate stuff. Currently, you might see unwanted stuff in gallery but removed within 24 hours. During weekend, they might be in gallery for longer because our staff takes time off during weekend (can't expect them to work 24/7 365 days a year). Like Patrick mentioned, we are already working on a system to clean the gallery. Once it's done & people start using it, you should see improvement in this area. We ask for patience because develop system like this takes time.

Glad to read that.

But supposing some pervert uploads a truly horrendous bit of kiddie porn and the authorities latch onto it before your control measures have removed it.

Doesn't that leave M9 and its admin staff exposed to prosecution? After all, you will have actually published it on the internet, albeit for a very short time.

@pdownes2001

That is value point there. That is why I have suggested that we put one more line of warning when someone uploads files. That we are not responsible for this, and that such files will be removed asap.

You are assuming that such a warning would provide M9 with an adequate defence in law. Has anyone checked that?

same rule aplies for sites like you tube you alow people to uplaod anything , and if it breaks the rules is removed.

it wold provide m9 a reason why we need some time to remve such content. Also it would show that m9 does not support such content. But I hav checked, that even if we don't put such sentence they need to warn us first before any legal action is taken. Also it can be seen from our gallery that such content is removed as soon as it is seen, or reported.

Well, whatever the system of control M9 is operating, it is falling down well below the mark that any court would expect. Open the theme below and check out its other screens. It is very debatable if this girl is 18. I wouldn't like to take the chance if I was an admin.

This theme has been on M9 since 13 Sept. Thats over two weeks! I found it in minutes because the contributer is known for uploading inappropriate content and no-one seems to be bothered. Any court is bound to ask, "Why didn't you cancel his membership and report him to the police?" That would be a hard question to answer.

http://gallery.mobile9.com/f/934565/

I advised this guy about his content and If i am not mistaken AW has spoken to him as well..

He seems unwilling to accept your advice. I know what I would do, if only for my own protection.

I'm going to leave it there now. I think this thread has gone as far as it can. My views are clear and so are the admin's views. I've done all I can.

I expect you will all come a cropper sooner or later but my conscience is clear.

I asume you mean ban members that dont comply?
If thats what you mean then i agree, i guess m9 is so huge that so much stuff that shouldnt be in the galery "falls through the cracks"

yesss

nooo

I'm not resurrecting an old discussion again. This is just something for M9 admin to keep an eye on, bearing in mind the issue of inappropriate content.

The interesting bit is, "Prosecutors argue that Google did not have adequate content filters or enough staff to monitor videos. "

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/8282293.stm

As AW said, we are looking into this issue. We know of a problem but need time to think of solutions, develop, code and test. Please be patient.

Also, we are aware of this law case already. Please note it is a lot easier said than done. The whole web could change because of that case, a lot of sites do not moderate content uploaded but rely on reports. We do both currently.

Will it mean hosting providers need to watch all sites on their servers- there are a lot of illegal content hosted. Will facebook need to validate every profile uploaded and every update. Etc

Thanks